K3 twin RRC1258 -- long delay before UDP CMD status OK

[W2NED]

RE: Elecraft K3 twins -- RRC-1258MkII (sw:2.91)
Problem: Can take several minutes for UDP cmd status to become OK(45)

Screenshots from Microbit  setup program  are available at :
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1OSb6C8EBCY95xZc8UmVbT03S3ax6jgCg

I have recently acquired a K3/0 - mini and a set of RRC - 1258MkII interface units to operate remote to a K3. Firmware in all units (radios and interfaces) have been updated to the latest versions.

I currently have the remote set up working over both LAN and internet configurations, with one remaining problem. When I first initiate connection by pressing the power button on the K3/0, it may take several minutes before the cmd channel makes connection and the K3/0 controls operate normally. After, things settle out, the K3/0 operates as expected and is very responsive.

If I turn the K3/0 off and back on with only a short time off (1 minute), the system reaches normal operation in a few seconds. This is OK.

However, if I turn the K3/0 off and wait for a longer time (like hours) before turning the unit on, it may take several minutes before connection is established. This is disconcerting.

Monitoring the RRC status page I observed that the power on and sound channels connect very quickly. It is only the control channel that is delayed.

While observing the K3/0 panel, after power on, I hear the beep indicating K3 is on and the unit enters Terminal mode very quickly, audio can be heard. The unit remains in the terminal mode with an inactive panel until the control channel becomes established. Then all is fine.

The referenced screenshots were made with the control and radio units side by side on a LAN. The  behavior is identical when the control location is remote over the internet.

I suspect I have a setting wrong some place. The current settings are mostly as received from Elecraft -- though I may have changed something inadvertently. Your collective guidance will be appreciated. Thank you…

Ned, W2NED

[dj0qn]

Hi Ned,

No, your settings are okay. Your problem is with your network somewhere.

You said that you had it working inside of the LAN. I assume that you did not experience this problem
in that configuration.

It could be one of many things: a router problem, a switch problem, a port conflict, etc. The only way to
locate the problem is by using the process of elimination. The first thing I would do is to move the control
RRC to another location and test it. If it works there okay, then the problem is at the control side, otherwise
at the radio side. Then you need to move through various steps to eliminate the cause until you find it.

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX

[W2NED]

Mitch,
Thanks for the prompt response.

Actually, the screen shots were taken at the Antique Wireless Museum (East Bloomfield, NY) where the Radio K3 is located. The other day I had both radio and control units set up at the museum working over the LAN. Today I have the control at my home and accessed the K3 over the internet network. I saw the same behavior at both locations -- over LAN and over the internet.

I will fetch the K3 from the museum and try them both at my home location. If the problem disappears, then we will assume the problem is at the museum. Then, we will get a network expert involved.

Our goal is ultimately to have the K3 radio at the museum and send the K3/0 to one of our members who was recently confined to a nursing home. If that works, then we will be setting up multiple remotes at the museum for members to access.

I will keep you posted...

Regards, Ned

[dj0qn]

Hi Ned,

I missed the screen shots before. Looking at the status screen, it indicates a good connect. The problem
is somewhere in the network. Perhaps a port conflict or something like that, but I have even seen bad
switches causing problems before.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX

[W2NED]

Mitch,
Here is an update.

I have both the radio and control co-located at my home now, and units are communicating over a LAN with the integrated NetGear router provided by our DSL / phone provider.

I am still seeing a relatively long delay for the control channel to become operative, after the radio and control have been off for hours, although the delay is now in the order of 1 - 2 minutes maximum. Again the delay goes down to a few seconds if the units have been off for only short time.

I could certainly live with this, if I thought it were normal. However, if the delay of a minute or more is a symptom of an underlying problem, I would like to find an fix the problem.

Having the radio and control in one place, I able to monitor the status pages at both ends as I turn the control unit on. Note that the RRC units are always powered on. Here is what I see as I repeatedly refresh the status pages.

- control and radio have been off for an hour or more, and all three channels (sip, audio and cmd) are disconnected as per the status pages on both RRC units.

- After I Press the Power button on the control unit, the sip and audio channels are OK within a couple seconds. At the Control unit, I hear the beep indicating remote radio is on, and the audio can be heard.

- However there can be delay of one to several minutes before the control panel becomes responsive.

- During this time I can watch the UDP status start from a low number like OK(15) and then slowly increase until reach a value of OK(43) to OK(45) at both ends. At that point, the panel and display active and responsive.

- After the connection has stabilized, the remote system operates as expected, and I have made a number of CW and SSB contacts.

Since, both RRC units are directly hard wired to a simple 4 port router, and all cables are new, short and appear to be working fine, the LAN is as simple as possible.

I assume the numbers in the cmd status -- like cmd(34) -- indicate the quality of the cmd channel. I do not understand what would cause these numbers (and connection quality) to increase slowly after a long off time and increase quickly after a short off time. In both cases the control panel is non-responsive until the cmd status reaches cmd(43) or better at both ends.

In all cases, once the cmd status stabilizes at cmd(43 - 45) the status remains good and everything works normally.

So, what is to be expected? Should I just accept the situation? Or, should I go to my local computer store and buy a better router?

Comments???

...Ned, W2NED


 

[dj0qn]

Hi Ned,

You have a strange and interesting problem. I have seen similar for internet connections, but not
within a LAN. However, that should make the search much easier.

I would go through the following possibilities:

- Make sure that SIP ALG is turned off in your router

- You didn't say which ports you are using. Never use port 5060, due to port conflicts. Otherwise, it sounds
like you may have a port conflict somewhere and changing the port numbers may solve the problem.

- Try turning off the router's firewall

- If one of the RRC's is plugged into a switch, try bypassing it or use a different switch

No matter what, it is a network problem and not an RRC problem. Using the process of elimination should help
you solve it.

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX

[W2NED]

Mitch,
Here is an update...

With both Radio and Control at my home QTH, I decided to try a newer and faster router. The first time (after a long off time) control delay was reduced from minutes to about 10 to 20 seconds. This certainly verifies your premise that the problem is with the network.

Moving the radio back to the museum, we are again experiencing a few minutes delay before the command channel is active -- after a long off time.

We have decided to live with the delay for now, but we will look at improving the museum network as time permits. An IT network specialist has recently joined our volunteer staff. As his time permits, he will attempt to improve the situation.

Thanks for you responsiveness...

Regards,
Ned, W2NED

[dj0qn]

Hi Ned,

Glad that you are making progress. These things can be hard to find, I can tell you lots
of stories   

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX